This is an uncorrected proof of evidence taken before the committee and it is made available under the condition it is recognised as such.
PARLIAMENTARY CRIME AND CORRUPTION COMMITTEE
Members present: Mr JM Krause MP—Chair Mr MJ Crandon MP Mrs MF McMahon MP Mr BL O’Rourke MP (virtual) Mr A Tantari MP (virtual) Dr MA Robinson MP Mr JA Sullivan MP Staff present: Ms E Jameson—Committee Secretary Mr G Thomson—Assistant Committee Secretary
MEETING WITH THE PARLIAMENTARY CRIME AND CORRUPTION COMMISSIONER
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
THURSDAY, 12 AUGUST 2021 Brisbane
Meeting with the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner
Brisbane - 1 - 12 Aug 2021
THURSDAY, 12 AUGUST 2021 ____________
The committee met at 1.04 pm. CHAIR: Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining us at this public meeting. To those
listening in online, thank you for watching the broadcast. I am Jon Krause, the member for Scenic Rim and chair of the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Committee. Joining me on the committee today are Mr Jimmy Sullivan, member for Stafford and deputy chair; Mr Michael Crandon, member for Coomera; Mrs Melissa McMahon, member for Macalister; and Dr Mark Robinson, member for Oodgeroo. On the phone are Mr Barry O’Rourke, member for Rockhampton; and Mr Adrian Tantari, member for Hervey Bay.
The committee’s proceedings are proceedings of the Queensland parliament and are subject to the standing rules and orders of the parliament. As parliamentary proceedings, under the standing orders any person may be excluded from the hearing at the discretion of the chair or by order of the committee. We are being recorded by Hansard today and broadcast live on the parliament’s website. Media may be present and are subject to my direction at all times. Media rules endorsed by the committee are available on request. All those present today should note it is possible you might be filmed or photographed during the proceedings by media, and images may also appear on the parliament’s website or social media pages.
The committee is beginning its meeting in public to deal with a number of matters. It will then commence its public meeting with the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner. The committee will then close the public part of the meeting and continue the remainder of the meeting in private session. The public meeting is scheduled to finish at a tentative time of 1.30 pm. Are there any apologies or declarations of interest relevant to the public session?
Mr SULLIVAN: There is my standing declaration, Chair. CHAIR: Anybody else? Members have been provided with a copy of the agenda for today’s
meeting. The resolution proposed and moved by me is that the agenda for 12 August 2021 as circulated be adopted. Those in favour? Those against? That is carried.
Members have been provided with a copy of the draft minutes for committee meetings held on 21 July 2021 and 2 August 2021. The proposed resolution is that the committee confirm the minutes of the committee meetings held on those dates as true and accurate records of the meetings.
Mr CRANDON: I so move. CHAIR: Any discussion? Those in favour? Those against? That is carried. Members have been
provided with copies of incoming and outgoing correspondence schedules. The proposed resolution is that the inward be accepted and the outward endorsed. I will move that. Any discussion? Those in favour? Those against? That is carried. We will now move to discussion of the parliamentary commissioner’s activities.
CARMODY, Ms Karen, Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner
KUNDE, Mr Mitchell, Principal Legal Officer, Office of the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner
CHAIR: I welcome Ms Karen Carmody, Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner, and Mr Kunde, Principal Legal Officer assisting the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner. I make a special mention of the Parliamentary Crime and Corruption Commissioner as she will be departing her post later in the month, on 21 August. This very well could be the last public meeting this committee holds with the commissioner. We thank you for your service over the last several years to the PCCC. In that vein, I ask you to make some comments and give a public report to the committee.
Ms Carmody: Thank you. Since the last meeting before the committee there has been substantial work, as you would realise, on the Logan City Council inquiry, so we do not have a substantial report to provide on this occasion. There have been the ongoing section 329 notices dealt with, but the vast majority of the time—certainly for Mr Kunde and to a lesser extent myself—has been taken up with the preparations for the inquiry commencing next week.
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There is one report to finalise—Mr Kunde has finalised it within the statutory period—being the intelligence data review. The review itself has to be conducted within four months of last financial year. That was conducted within that period, but there is no date by which the report has to be provided. Mr Kunde imagines that the report will be able to be provided after the inquiry has concluded.
Mr Kunde: There may be time to do it before the Logan City Council inquiry. I think I indicated to the committee at the last meeting that I would have it done within a couple of weeks. I am sorry that has not been possible, but it is not too far away. Part of it will involve visiting the CCC and the QPS to touch base with the officers I have dealt with in that, and that was not possible last week due to the lockdown. It is not too far away. The inspections were all done in time.
Ms Carmody: The other issue has been the shutdown periods, where it has not been possible to attend here. Other than that, they are the main issues that have been attended to by the office in the period. I would like to formally record my thanks first of all to Mr Kunde, without whom I do not think this role could function, frankly. His services are invaluable not only to me but also to all the previous parliamentary commissioners. As I have said before, he has not only longstanding knowledge of the position, having been in it for nearly 20 years now—
Mr Kunde: More than 20 years. Ms Carmody: More than 20 years, since almost the very first parliamentary commissioner. He
also has an extraordinary memory and can locate documents et cetera. I would like to formally record his assistance. He is also quite charming from time to time!
I would also like to thank the current committee members and the previous committee members over the years for their courtesy and the assistance they have afforded me on occasions when I have needed assistance with my work as well. I must say, frankly—I do not say it in any trite way—that I have been impressed by the calibre of the committee. This is the first occasion that I have had direct contact with politicians other than voting. I was always curious as to what they might be like in the pursuance of their duties. I have found committee members over the years very dedicated and diligent and impressive representatives for their electorates. I thank you for the privilege of having worked with you all as well. The parliamentary staff we have had over the years have also been excellent. People such as Erin have also been excellent. Thank you, all.
CHAIR: Thank you, Ms Carmody, for that statement. Do any members have questions or comments?
Mr SULLIVAN: I associate myself, Chair, with your opening comments and thank you, Ms Carmody, for your years of service. We have always enjoyed a robust discussion. As well, I really appreciate the timely and frank advice that you give back to us on very sensitive, complex issues. Thank you very much for your years of service.
Ms Carmody: Thank you. CHAIR: Are there any other questions or comments? I remind members to be careful not to
refer to any private matters in the public part of the meeting. Dr ROBINSON: I echo everything that has been said and thank you very much on a personal
level. Ms Carmody: Thank you. Mr CRANDON: Thank you, Ms Carmody, for the interesting slant you put on so many things
in our hearings, in the feedback that you give to us, in both the private and public meetings. It is refreshing. I wish you well for your future endeavours.
Ms Carmody: Thank you very much. CHAIR: Ms Carmody, I will attempt to ask a question, but are there any matters outstanding of
which you are able to inform the committee in this session? Ms Carmody: Yes, the review that we referred to then. I will just check whether it has to be in
the private meeting. Mr Kunde: There is another matter that you have been asked to provide advice on. Ms Carmody: There is one shorter matter that I have to finalise. That should not take long,
because it has been in draft form. In the meantime, I have provided two other reports. Perhaps Ms Jameson has a recollection of something else that is outstanding?
CHAIR: Not outstanding, but I was going to ask whether you have any comments at all to offer about the committee’s five-year review report that was tabled on 30 June.
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Ms Carmody: Yes, I do have some comments about that, if that is appropriate. Without sounding too superior, I was greatly in support of the contents of that report. There were some submissions to the committee seeking changes or making suggestions of various kinds that were I think appropriately considered by the committee and there was nothing that emerged from that report that I did not think should have been addressed. I think it was a well-considered report. I look forward to the challenges that the various committees will go over in future years when asked to provide further powers to organisations or restrain organisations as to how the committees and the growing powers within these organisations develop over the years to come.
CHAIR: Thank you, Ms Carmody. There being no other questions from members of the committee, I thank you very much again for your contribution and for your appearance here today. We will close this public session of our meeting and move into the private section of the meeting. Thank you to everybody who has been watching.
The committee adjourned at 1.15 pm.